2018-09-09, 00:59
  #97
Medlem
PTSD-av-AFs avatar
M.Luther höll på att förlora sin tro i skepsism till Kyrkan. Han insåg exempelvis att det inte var så legitimt av Katolikerna att sälja biljetter till himmelen exempelvis. Vår Lutheranska Kyrka var åtminstone helig en gång i tiden. Idag praktiserar man dock dödssynderna och bryter mot andra skriftregler likaså. Kyrkan är idag ett politiskt spelrum och därför lämnar folket den i massor. Dessutom sparar det många tusen på den årliga skatten.
Citera
2018-09-12, 00:00
  #98
Medlem
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av freeriderXII
En viktig skillnad mellan protestantismen och katolicismen är att protestanterna bara utgår från Bibeln medans den katolska kyrkan även har sina egna traditioner (som att be till helgon). Vem är egentligen den riktiga kättaren? I förhållande till Gud.

Det är viktigare att följa Bibeln än att följa den katolska kyrkans doktriner.

Utgick Jesu och de första apostlarna från någon bok själva? Nej. Bibeln är en utmärkt guide och central referenseverk. Dock är kyrkan mer levande än så.

Sola scriptura är en recept för irrläror och extemism. Se vart alla wahabbis, salafister, och döds-protestanter har kommit.
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2018-09-12, 09:15
  #99
Medlem
Furiennas avatar
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av lingonfett
Utgick Jesu och de första apostlarna från någon bok själva? Nej. Bibeln är en utmärkt guide och central referenseverk. Dock är kyrkan mer levande än så.

Sola scriptura är en recept för irrläror och extemism. Se vart alla wahabbis, salafister, och döds-protestanter har kommit.
Korstågen var ju annars ett katolskt påhitt.
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2018-09-14, 18:29
  #100
Medlem
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av Furienna
Men jag tror att helgonen har uppfyllt ett visst behov hos människor, som har blivit förbisett av de protestantiskt kristna. Särskilt de kvinnliga helgonen som Jungfru Maria behövdes mycket väl i den annars så mansdominerade kristendomen. Vem tror du att kvinnor som födde barn bad till på medeltiden? Men då Luther och de andra reformatorerna ju var män, så begrep de inte detta. Nunneklostren var också kvinnornas enda chans till utbildning på medeltiden, men det var inte heller något som reformatorerna (som ju var män och hade fått gå på universitet) begrep. Så de tog bort både helgonen och klostren.

Vi kan tilläga att med klostren nedstängda hade kvinnor få möjligheter att freda sig från män. Man kunde inte skölda sig från att bli betraktade som objekt för sex, klanpolitik, barnafödande.

Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av freeriderXII
Men Gud säger ju att du skall inga andra Gudar hava jämte mig. Det är det första budet.


Att det känns bra att be till Maria är inget argument för om man vill kalla sig kristen. Jag är rätt säker på att Maria själv inte vill att folk ber till henne.
Vanliga protestanter brukar vara ganska okunniga om Maria, så att om du han inge annat att tilläga än att upprepa ett protestantisk meme om katolska "idoler" så håll dig till din ateist-främjande "kyrka".
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2018-09-14, 21:09
  #101
Medlem
ekerilars avatar
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av lingonfett

Vanliga protestanter brukar vara ganska okunniga om Maria, så att om du han inge annat att tilläga än att upprepa ett protestantisk meme om katolska "idoler" så håll dig till din ateist-främjande "kyrka".

Eh! En av de främsta anledningarna till att jag är protestant är att jag helgar det första budet.
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2018-09-15, 19:02
  #102
Medlem
freeriderXIIs avatar
Här lite om motreformationen mot Luthers protestantism och om jesuiterna specifikt. Han/författaren nämner inte att Rothschilds är judar förvisso det är inte bara Vatikanen som har stor makt. Olika maktcentra infiltrerar varandra. Men det är alltså dessa gossar/jesuiterna som lingonfett gillar. Om det är bra eller inte får ni själva avgöra:


Citat:


Länk


Resident Evil: The Jesuit Threat to Humanity

by Mike Bellinger

The New Resistance

Real History

There is an invisible power which secretly rules.
When Martin Luther sparked the spiritual and social revolution in Europe we now know as the Reformation, he sent an arrow deep into the heart of the Vatican power base. As the Reformation spread and enlightenment became commonplace, the Dark Ages ended, didn't they? Apparently they did not. The Vatican, in its lust for power over all human life, soon spawned an advocate who was worthy of the devil himself. He went by the name of Ignatius Loyola. Loyola was a self-made man. He suffered many trials and defeats in his life, but persevered to become the head of what he named the "Society of Jesus" whose members later became better known under their assigned nickname: the Jesuits.

Ignatius Loyola formed the Jesuits as a military order with the stated purpose of overthrowing the reformation started by Martin Luther and restoring the temporal (political) and religious domination of the Vatican in all walks of life. In other words, he wanted to bring back the Dark Ages. The domination of the Vatican and the Pope as Monarch over all Kings, Queens, secular leaders and the rest of humanity was (and still is) the avowed mission of the Society of Jesus.

Loyola's mandate was that the end justified the means, and any means of restoring Vatican domination was acceptable. The mission of the Jesuits was the extermination of all heresy and all heretics. Protestants and all other non-Catholics must be converted or eliminated - either sooner or later. The saying among the Jesuits was that "It is no sin to kill a heretic". This murderous justification apparently became their creed.

They demanded absolute, unquestioning obedience from their members. To achieve the fourth and highest vow of initiation, and thereby be initiated into the actively evil pyramidal top level, a Jesuit must be a loyal member for 35 years. This requirement ensured the smallest possibility of dissent or original thinking ever surviving in anyone reaching leadership role, or from ever altering their stated purpose or mission as set out by founder Ignatius Loyola.

As a military order, they fought many open political wars with European Kings, Queens and statesmen. Their favored tool against such power was assassination. Because of their small numbers, they became experts on poisoning and all known methods of assassination. They were even connected to the Borgias, as in Lucretia Borgia.

In those days most everyone had a confessor. The Jesuits deliberately sought these roles and came to dominate the confessor positions in European society. In that role they were able to use the intelligence they gathered from their political, social and business victims to gain advantage in politics, business and education. The confessor spies then used that information and position coupled with blackmail, bribery and intimidation to seek advantage for the Vatican in every endeavor. The Jesuit intelligence apparatus is unequaled on this planet. They were in place before we ever even dreamed of such an enterprise. Their missionaries carried this intelligence gathering on throughout the world when Columbus opened up the frontier, and no one has ever outdone them. This is one of the secrets of the Jesuit-Vatican control of much of the world.

The other very successful and crucial tactic they employed was to infiltrate all of their enemies. Opposing religions, enemy political structures, business, media and education, both domestic and foreign, were infiltrated by Jesuit missionaries and the many unidentifiable junior Jesuits: those secular followers who were all too willing to accept Jesuit favors and position in exchange for selling their countries and their souls to the Vatican.

What happened in Europe was that after 250 hundred years of bloody Jesuit-instigated massacres of Protestants, the bloody Jesuit Inquisitions (some estimates put the total Vatican and Jesuit death toll at 60 million human beings, making Hitler seem like an amateur) and resulting wars with European monarchs and statesmen, the Jesuits had been taking quite a beating themselves. Many had been executed outright, and as a group they were thrown out of almost every country in Europe at one time or another. Even several popes turned against them due to public outcries from some still loyal Catholic countries. But they always somehow managed to regroup and return. When they did, they always extracted bloody revenge on whatever country or ruler had expelled them. They killed the popes who banished them and took over the Vatican completely in the 1700's. This would prevent any further rear-guard actions against them in the future as they had suffered previously. This consolidation of Jesuit control over the Vatican itself marked a new phase in the ongoing battle against Protestantism and all the other non-Catholic "heretics" of the world at large.

The lessons learned from open conflicts with the European powers led to the next and most sinister phase of the Jesuit takeover of world society. They realized that the most effective and efficient method of seizing control of a society was by their already useful tactic of infiltration, but this time in secret. The instruments of that infiltration would be the many secret societies which they targeted and assumed control of. The international nature of the Masonic brotherhood made them an ideal tool for using its membership to advance Jesuit goals. Publicly, the Vatican and the Masons were enemies; but F. Tupper Saussy found evidence linking them, and Jon Eric Phelps notes that Adam Wieshaupt, the founder of modern Bavarian Freemasonry was a Jesuit agent.

The Knights of Malta (formerly Knights Templar) are the premiere secret society of the Vatican these days, but they are subservient to the Jesuit General. Many of America and the Western World's power elite are Knights of Malta.

Once they spread their influence through the secret societies worldwide and coordinated with the English Roundtables to impose a worldwide network of control, the whole phenomena evolved into what we know of today as the New World Order (or what the elite-controlled press so disingenuously refers to as Globalism, as if that is something to be desired). The Globalists have many nicknames, but their agenda is one and the same. It is total control of this planet. They have many factions who compete with one another for position and advantage like a group of churlish relatives, but the ultimate goal is always unchanged. And the Jesuit overlords lurk in the background, pulling all the important strings.

If you know anything about the history of the elite Brotherhood, then you will know that the Rothschild’s banking faction developed the art of financing wars from both sides of a conflict by utilizing the secrets of Central Banking with their ability to create enormous debt loads in the resident populations resulting from the issuance of government authorized fiat money. The incredible profits generated by war, reaped from both the winners and losers, led to a syndrome where induced wars became a way of life for the overlords because of the vast financial profits and additional benefits derived from it.

In addition to massive financial profits, war results in many other '"benefits" for the overlords. Some of the most important to them are increased centralized control of the population by government, increased militarization, and the public fear of conflicts to come, leading them to let their "peace-loving" statesmen do all their thinking for them.

But the Jesuits have a much darker rationale behind all the world conflicts they have overseen in the last 600 years. They have used all of these various wars as cover-ups for their mass exterminations of Protestants and all other non-Catholic peoples worldwide. This is the real horror of the Jesuits and the Vatican. They are the most prolific mass murders in all of human history. No one and nothing else in known human history compares to their record of calculated genocide. Now you know why we must stop this evil. The Vatican, as it is now, is the incarnation of hell itself. There can be no doubt of that.

Here are some Jesuit/Vatican atrocities to mull over.

The Crusades: Who knows how many died? And then the children’s crusades ... Good God.

The Inquisitions: In “Vatican Assassins,” Eric Jon Phelps cites a source that estimates roughly 60 million people were murdered in the various stages of the Inquisitions. Think about that number for a minute. Most of these people were tortured to death.

Catherine De Medici instigated the butchering of 75,000 French Protestant Huguenots on August 24, 1572. In 1598 Henry IV issued the Edict of Nates to protect them. By manipulating the rescinding of the protective Edict of Nantes in 1685 by the Jesuit confessor to King Louis XIV (using religious blackmail), another HALF MILLION FRENCH HUGUENOTS were butchered by the vile French Catholic Dragonades. In 1655 again, British Protestant hero Oliver Cromwell threatened to invade France and crush the French Crown for a new massacre being waged upon the French Vadois Protestants of valley of Piedmont by six Catholic Regiments by the Duke of Savoy. forts tryck på länken.

__________________
Senast redigerad av freeriderXII 2018-09-15 kl. 19:18.
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2018-09-15, 19:19
  #103
Medlem
freeriderXIIs avatar
Cromwell släppte in affärsjudar till Storbritannien igen för första gången på flera hundra år (om man hoppar över maranos) så han var köpt också om än inte av Vatikanen.




Här en gammal klassiker om inkvisitionen
__________________
Senast redigerad av freeriderXII 2018-09-15 kl. 20:00.
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2018-09-15, 20:29
  #104
Medlem
Jeckes avatar
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av freeriderXII
Här lite om motreformationen mot Luthers protestantism och om jesuiterna specifikt. Han/författaren nämner inte att Rothschilds är judar förvisso det är inte bara Vatikanen som har stor makt. Olika maktcentra infiltrerar varandra. Men det är alltså dessa gossar/jesuiterna som lingonfett gillar. Om det är bra eller inte får ni själva avgöra:
Det är tyvärr svårt att ta honom på allvar när han gör så enkla och idiotiska misstag som det här:

"The Knights of Malta (formerly Knights Templar) are the premiere secret society of the Vatican these days, but they are subservient to the Jesuit General. Many of America and the Western World's power elite are Knights of Malta. "
Nej, Knights of Malta var inte Knights Templar (tempelriddare, tempelherrarorden) utan var hospitaliter (Knights Hospitaller, Knights of St John). Med bara tre möjliga riddarordnar, där den tredje är tämligen okänd, så lyckas han ändå inte att få det rätt.
Citera
2018-09-15, 21:38
  #105
Medlem
freeriderXIIs avatar
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av Jecke

Det är tyvärr svårt att ta honom på allvar när han gör så enkla och idiotiska misstag som det här:

"The Knights of Malta (formerly Knights Templar) are the premiere secret society of the Vatican these days, but they are subservient to the Jesuit General. Many of America and the Western World's power elite are Knights of Malta. "
Nej, Knights of Malta var inte Knights Templar (tempelriddare, tempelherrarorden) utan var hospitaliter (Knights Hospitaller, Knights of St John). Med bara tre möjliga riddarordnar, där den tredje är tämligen okänd, så lyckas han ändå inte att få det rätt

Bra påpekan vad gäller hospitaliterna.

Författaren är givetvis väldigt partisk och ensidig mot katolska kyrkan men man får väga olika källor mot varandra. Att jesuiterna ofta låtit ändamålet helga medlen genom historien (dass der Zweck das Mittel heilige) är dock hyfsat klart.

__________________
Senast redigerad av freeriderXII 2018-09-15 kl. 21:40.
Citera
2018-09-15, 21:52
  #106
Medlem
freeriderXIIs avatar
Det finns de som vill skylla de mesta av det onda i världen på Vatikanen och andra på judarna och tredje på muslimerna sanningen är lite mer komplex.


Luther gillade dock varken Vatikanen, judarna eller muslimerna.

__________________
Senast redigerad av freeriderXII 2018-09-15 kl. 21:54.
Citera
2018-09-15, 21:59
  #107
Medlem
freeriderXIIs avatar
Martin Luther är värd en staty i Sverige men det skall. givetvis inte ses som en avgudabild.
__________________
Senast redigerad av freeriderXII 2018-09-15 kl. 22:05.
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2018-09-16, 08:49
  #108
Avstängd
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av lingonfett
Utgick Jesu och de första apostlarna från någon bok själva?
"Tro inte att jag har kommit för att upphäva lagen eller profeterna. Jag har inte kommit för att upphäva utan för att fullborda. "

Jesus utgick i högsta grad från tidigare judiska läror.
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