2010-05-20, 14:21
  #3229
Medlem
NS_14s avatar
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av Isglass
Det är allmänt känt att italienare introducerade EPO i cykelsporten. Framförallt Professor Conconi och Doktor Ferrari.

Allmänt känt bland oupplysta möjligtvis. Man gjorde inga tester på EPO innan upptäckten av dess effekter gjordes. Varken Conconi eller Ferrari (Conconis "protegé") är några "introducerare" utan snarare "spridare". Det var ju Conconci själv som initierade att under Lillehammer-OS testa effekterna på några av de amatörer som han försett med EPO.

Läs den holländske journalisten Mart Smeets bok The last yellow om ex-cyklisten Steven Rooks bekännelser om hur Belgiska och holländska cyklister systematiskt nyttjade EPO så tidigt som omkring 1986.
__________________
Senast redigerad av NS_14 2010-05-20 kl. 14:26.
Citera
2010-05-20, 15:23
  #3230
Medlem
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av NS_14
Allmänt känt bland oupplysta möjligtvis. Man gjorde inga tester på EPO innan upptäckten av dess effekter gjordes. Varken Conconi eller Ferrari (Conconis "protegé") är några "introducerare" utan snarare "spridare". Det var ju Conconci själv som initierade att under Lillehammer-OS testa effekterna på några av de amatörer som han försett med EPO.

Läs den holländske journalisten Mart Smeets bok The last yellow om ex-cyklisten Steven Rooks bekännelser om hur Belgiska och holländska cyklister systematiskt nyttjade EPO så tidigt som omkring 1986.

Det var ju naturligtvis det jag menade. Att några enstaka belgare och holländare använde EPO på 80-talet är mindre intressant när du frågar varifrån EPO-explosionen kom ifrån.
Citera
2010-05-20, 15:39
  #3231
Medlem
Brevet ifråga.

2002: I was instructed on how to use Testosterone patches by Johan Bruyneel
during the During the Dauphine Libere in June, after which I flew on a
helicopter with Mr Armstrong from the finish, I believe Grenoble, to San
Mauritz Switzerland at which point I was personally handed a box of 2.5 mg
patches in front of his wife who witnessed the exchange. About a week
later, Dr Ferrari performed an extraction of half a liter of blood to be
transfused back into me during the Tour de France. Mr Armstrong was not
witness to the extraction but he and I had lengthy discussions about it on
our training rides during which time he also explained to me the evolution
of EPO testing and how transfusions were now necessary due to the
inconvenience of the new test. He also divulged to me at that time that in
the first year that the EPO test was used he had been told by Mr Ferrari,
who had access to the new test, that he should not use EPO anymore but he
did not believe Mr Farrari and contin
ued to use it. He later, while winning the Tour de Swiss, the month before
the Tour de France, tested positive for EPO at which point he and Mr
Bruyneel flew to the UCI headquarters and made a financial agreement with
Mr. Vrubrugen to keep the positive test hidden
.

2003: After a broken hip in the winter, I flew to Gerona Spain where this
time two units (half a liter each) were extracted three weeks apart. This
took place in the apartment in which Mr. Armstrong lived and in which I was
asked to stay and check the blood temperature every day. It was kept in a
small refrigerator in the closet allong with the blood of Mr Armstrong and
George Hincapie and since Mr. Armstrong was planning on being gone for a few
weeks to train he asked me to stay in his place and make sure the
electricity didn't turn off or something go wrong with the referigerator.
Then during the Tour de France the entire team, on two different occasions
went to the room that we were told and the doctor met us there to do the
transfusions. During that Tour de France I personally witnessed George
Hincapie, Lance Armstrong, Chechu Rubiera, and myself receiving blood
transfusions. Also during that Tour de France the team doctor would give my
room mate, George Hincapie an
d I a small syringe of olive oil in which was disolved andriol, a form of
ingestible testosterone on two out of three nights throughout the duration.

I was asked to ride the Vuelta a Espana that year in support of Roberto
Heras and in August, between the Tour and the Vuelta, was told to take EPO
to raise my hematocrit back up so more blood transfusions could be
performed. I was instructed to go to Lances place by Johan Bruyneel and get
some EPO from him. The first EPO I ever used was then handed to me in the
entry way to his building in full view of his then wife. It was Eprex by
brand and it came in six pre measured syringes. I used it intravenously for
several weeks before the next blood draw and had no problems with the tests
during the Vuelta. Also during this time it was explained to me how to use
Human Growth Hormone by Johan Bruyneel and I bought what I needed from Pepe
the team "trainer" who lived in Valencia along with the team doctor at that
time. While training for that Vuelta I spent a good deal of time training
with Matthew White and Michael Barry and shared the testosterone and EPO
that we had and discu
ssed the use thereof while training.

Again, during the Vuelta we were given Andriol and blood transfusions by the
team doctor and had no problems with any testing.

2004: Again the team performed two seperate blood transfusions on me, but
this time Bruyneel had become more paranoid and we did the draws by flying
to Belgium and meeting at an unknown persons appartment and the blood was
brought by "Duffy" who was at that time Johans assistant of sorts. The
second of which was performed on the team bus on the ride from the finish of
a stage to the hotel during which the driver pretended to have engine
trouble and stopped on a remote mountain road for an hour or so so the
entire team could have half a liter of blood added. This was the only time
that I ever saw the entire team being transfused in plain view of all the
other riders and bus driver. That team included Lance Armstrong, George
Hincapie and I as the only Americans.

2005: I had learned at this point how to do most of the transfusion
technicals and other things on my own so I hired Allen Lim as my assistant
to help with details and logistics. He helped Levi Leipheimer and I prepare
the transfusions for Levi and I and made sure they were kept at the proper
temperature. We both did two seperate transfusions that Tour however my
hematocrit was too low at the start so I did my first one a few days before
the start so as to not start with a deficit.

2006: Well you get the idea....... One thing of great signigicance is that
I sat down with Andy Riis and explained to him what was done in the past and
what was the risk I would be taking and ask for his permission which he
granted in the form of funds to complete the operation described. John
Lelangue was also informed by me and Andy Riis consulted with Jim Ochowitz
before agreeing.

There are many many more details that I have in diaries and am in the
process of writing into an intelligible story but since the position of USA
Cycling is that there have not been enough details shared to justify calling
USADA, I am writing as many as I can reasonably put into an email and share
with you so as to ascertain what is the process which USA Cycling uses to
proceed with such allegations.

Look forward to much more detail as soon as you can demonstrate that you can
be trusted to do the right thing.

Floyd Landis
Citera
2010-05-20, 21:13
  #3232
Medlem
Zalkmans avatar
Armstrong kraschade just i TOC och bröt tävlingen i samband med det. Sammanträffande med tanke på dagens händelse? Ska hur som helst bli intressant att se efterspelet av det hela och om han verkligen kommer att ställa upp i årets Tour de France.
Citera
2010-05-20, 23:09
  #3233
Medlem
Ozmeisters avatar
Men varför visar eurosport damfotboll nu för?!
Citera
2010-05-20, 23:48
  #3234
Medlem
Markmags avatar
Märkbart irriterad Evans idag. Han och Righi vevade ju mot varandra och käftade lite mot slutet. Evans blev väl stirrig när de andra "favoriterna" gått iväg mot slutet. Tydligen böter, men inga tidsavdrag, för Evans/Righi. Kul att Pozzato vann idag, äntligen en hemmaseger på detta Giro.
Citera
2010-05-21, 12:01
  #3235
Medlem
NS_14s avatar
Går inte att tvivla på var Eurosport UK´s sympatier ligger. Under direktsändningen flådde Kirby (Bäckstedt var bisittare) Landis trovärdighet innan de bröt för "Planet Armstrong".

Video från Armstrongs "krasch", Nota bene att Chechu som också kraschade fortsatte loppet
http://video.bicycling.com/video/ATOC-Lance-Armstrong-crashes-ou


Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av Isglass
Det var ju naturligtvis det jag menade. Att några enstaka belgare och holländare använde EPO på 80-talet är mindre intressant när du frågar varifrån EPO-explosionen kom ifrån.

Fast det var en explosion redan på 80-talet, även om det då gav knappa 3% effekthöjande. Två andra belgare (Gert Jakobs & Mathieu Hermans) erkände nyttjandet av EPO. IIRC rapporterade 20 döda holländare (hjärtattack) med Draaijer och Oosterbosh som de mest kända. 90-talet följde en liknande utvecklingskurva där Carrera-stallet var de första varifrån EPO´t sipprade ut.

Jag är intresserad av hur EPO började cirkulera i första hand inom cyklingen.

OT: Federala myndigheter kommer att utreda Landis anklagelser då Landis tagit kontakt med FDA agenten Jeff Novitsky. Novitsky är samme person som drog Marion Jones och Tim Montomery upp i dagsljuset. Intressant är att i Landis privata mail till Armstrong (då de verkat maila varandra innan hans bekännelser kom ut) framgick att Armstrong hävdat att han har "kontakter inom Anti-doping byråerna", ett brev publicerat i Wallstreet Journal.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703559004575256913635747280.html?m od=quicklinks_landis

Armstrong tar till gamla knep (ett knep som påminner om när han hotade Betsy Andreu):
According to Landis, the original purpose of the leaked e-mail was to admit to doping and to demonstrate to the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency (USADA) how drug doping was accomplished without detection. Landis claims he included others because he was trying to negotiate amnesty for himself and the riders named before supplying the dopers' regimen to USADA.

Talking about the leaked e-mail, Landis said, "I would have preferred that it had stayed private and the result of me coming clean (with this information) would be for the purpose of better doping controls so future generations of riders would not have to make the same decisions I had to make."

Landis went on to say that Armstrong had heard about previous e-mail exchanges between Landis and USA Cycling officials regarding his claims of doping. In an attempt to silence Landis after the Tour of Gila, Landis claims Armstrong called Dr. Kay, Landis' good friend and title sponsor of his current team, and made veiled threats about revoking Dr. Kay's doctor's license for misdiagnosing Landis' mental health.Landis' response was to say he should take aim at Landis himself and not his friends.

Landis replied to Armstrong via e-mail requesting that he not involve his friends but instead attempt to resolve the matter in court
http://www.versus.com/blogs/2010-cyc...andis-advance/
__________________
Senast redigerad av NS_14 2010-05-21 kl. 12:41.
Citera
2010-05-21, 12:44
  #3236
Medlem
mishimas avatar
Går verkligen hjärtinfarkterna härleda till Epo-användning. På den tiden var den populäraste drogen "The Belgian cocktail". En drogmix som bestod av, citerar från boken Breaking chain av Willy Voet, "amphetamines, caffeine, cocaine, heroin, painkillers and sometimes corticosteroides: a magic potion to keep you up all night".

Epo skapar väl främst blodproppar, som dock kan sätta sig i hjärtat, men jag skulle gissa på att det främst är den drogmixen som skapar infarkter.
Citera
2010-05-21, 12:47
  #3237
Medlem
CrapStacks avatar
Typiskt att dagspressen nu börjar skriva som faan om cykling och det är som vanligt nästan bara negativt. Att läsa kommentaterna från diverse tyckare är ju inte heller något man behöver ägna någon större uppmärksamhet, men det var ett inlägg på aftonbladets "debatt" som fångade mig, kanske inte direkt någon nyhet men jag har iaf inte tänkt på det innan

salsasas, 22 år, Igår 13:54 (aftonbladet)
""""""
Detta var intressant.
Landis also claims in the e-mail that Armstrong had told him Bruyneel met with the International Cycling Union to ensure details of a positive test remained confidential due to a “financial agreement”." Förmodligen anledningen till att cyklister som Heras, Landis, Beltran, Hamilton mfl aldrig torskade under Bruynels ledning men åkte dit efter att ha bytt lag.
"""
Finns det fler som åkt dit efter de bytt lag? Fanns det några som åkte fast under Bruynels ledning?
Citera
2010-05-21, 12:54
  #3238
Medlem
mishimas avatar
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av CrapStack
Finns det fler som åkt dit efter de bytt lag? Fanns det några som åkte fast under Bruynels ledning?

Kinesen som åkte fast härom månaden är den första i ett Bruyneel-styrt lag som har åkt fast. Det finns dock en gedigen lista på åkare på US Postal-cyklister som har torskat i efterhand; Tyler Hamilton, Manuel Béltran, Roberto Heras, Floyd Landis och säkert någon till jag inte kommer på nu.
Citera
2010-05-21, 12:58
  #3239
Medlem
NS_14s avatar
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av mishima
Går verkligen hjärtinfarkterna härleda till Epo-användning. På den tiden var den populäraste drogen "The Belgian cocktail". En drogmix som bestod av, citerar från boken Breaking chain av Willy Voet, "amphetamines, caffeine, cocaine, heroin, painkillers and sometimes corticosteroides: a magic potion to keep you up all night".

Epo skapar väl främst blodproppar, som dock kan sätta sig i hjärtat, men jag skulle gissa på att det främst är den drogmixen som skapar infarkter.

Kan naturligtvis vara en blandning. När Draaijer dog -89 till följd av hjärtattack så citat hans hustru: It was a random thing happened[...]Well, het got sick after taking EPO.

EPO´t har naturligtvis förfinats genom åren. Titta på Armstrongs testresultat (pre-Ferrari) på 370 watt jämte den 480 Watts motor han satt på efteråt och jämför även med de samtida cyklisterna på 90-talet. Vi snackar en ökning på nästan 100 watt. Intressant är också att detta skedde samtidigt som EPOs effekter toppades.
http://www.cyclismag.com/article.php?sid=2500
Citera
2010-05-21, 13:14
  #3240
Medlem
NS_14s avatar
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av CrapStack
Typiskt att dagspressen nu börjar skriva som faan om cykling och det är som vanligt nästan bara negativt. Att läsa kommentaterna från diverse tyckare är ju inte heller något man behöver ägna någon större uppmärksamhet, men det var ett inlägg på aftonbladets "debatt" som fångade mig, kanske inte direkt någon nyhet men jag har iaf inte tänkt på det innan

salsasas, 22 år, Igår 13:54 (aftonbladet)
""""""
Detta var intressant.
Landis also claims in the e-mail that Armstrong had told him Bruyneel met with the International Cycling Union to ensure details of a positive test remained confidential due to a “financial agreement”." Förmodligen anledningen till att cyklister som Heras, Landis, Beltran, Hamilton mfl aldrig torskade under Bruynels ledning men åkte dit efter att ha bytt lag.
"""
Finns det fler som åkt dit efter de bytt lag? Fanns det några som åkte fast under Bruynels ledning?

I dagens La Gazzeta (översatt):

Against Verbruggen:

Landis sustains that Armstrong confided to him the positive for EPO he had gotten at the Tour of Swizerland in 2002 (though it was 2001). Then Dr. Ferrari had warned Lance about the risks of continued EPO use given the new tests, but he still continued to take it. So when he was found positive, Armstrong and Bruyneel went to the UCI president, Hein Verbruggen, and settled upon a sum to ot make the positive revealed.

Landis said Bruyneel taught him how to take EPO in 2003, then recounts a veritable team doping at the 2004 Tour: "On our return to the hotel after the stage the team driver faked a mechanical problem, so we went down this back mountain road for an hour and so each rider was able to get his refill, a half liter of treated blood. It was the only time the entire team took doping together and not one by one. The team inculded myself, Armstrong and Hinacapie, the only Americans."

"Twice," Landis said "I got transfusions with Levi Leipheimer at the 2005 Tour," even if the two were on different teams then.

He confessed to have asked his Phonak DS, Andy Rihs, for money to continue his doping. John Lelangue, now team manager of BMC of Cadel Evans, was also informed of his request, the former then consulted with Jim Ochowitz for the ok....


Om detta är korrekt betyder det att Bruyneel och Lance mutat Verbruggen. Och under sådana omständigheter skulle ett "gentlemens agreement" kunna vara att trolla lite med det egna lagets tester. Varför jag finner det positivt att Landis även skickat sina mail till Federala myndigheter. Det är helt enkelt lite svårare att muta federala myndigheter än interna cykelorganisationer som säkerligen vill skydda sin idrotts image.
Citera

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