2020-07-31, 01:58
  #358165
Medlem
HerrGickhans avatar
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av DoraF
Jodå, jag har argument.
Det räcker egentligen med att konstatera att Sveriges befolkning sedan 2000-talets ökat med 1,4 miljoner fler innevånare.
Med andra ord har vi blivit 16 procent fler.
Andelen äldre i befolkningen har också ökat kraftigt sedan millennieskiftet.

Det säger sig självt att en jämförelse mellan 2000 och 2020 gällande antalet döda per år i absoluta tal inte blir särskilt rättvisande.

SCB gör oftast jämförelser mellan de senaste fem åren (2015 - 2019), vilket är ett mer rättvisande intervall.

Att befolkningen ökat innebär ju att fler borde dö om man räknar i antal. Att fler är äldre borde ytterligare verka i den riktningen. Det innebär att ett normalintervall över tidsperioden 20 år inte är en underskattning om man ser det så.

Det som jag hellre skulle anföra som argument är möjligen att det kommit fram bättre mediciner och behandlingar som hjälper till ett längre liv.

På det hela taget tror jag ändå att mitt skattade normalintervall är en godtagbar utgångspunkt inte långt från sanningen.
Citera
2020-07-31, 02:27
  #358166
Medlem
Grollarens avatar
Hejsan i natten

Efterfrågar lite länkar om den nya muteringen som är mer aggressiv och skyndar på sjukdomsförloppet och smittar mer som nu tydligen dykt upp i Vietnam, 80 000 evakueras?
Sen söker jag länk till studien som visar att antikroppar gör att man inte smittar fast man har Corona?
Tråden är lite lång för att söka.
Citera
2020-07-31, 02:58
  #358167
Medlem
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av rezpekt1057
Jag lägger mina pengar på att det inte blir en andra våg.

I’m pretty sure there will be, and the R0 will rise in August. Time will, as always, tell.
Citera
2020-07-31, 03:02
  #358168
Medlem
barkies avatar
Inte varit här på länge och förstår nu varför.

I blåa hörnet står alla domedagsprofeter.

I det röda hörnet alla förnekare och egoister.

Profeterna sprider oro, osanning, ovetenskaplig information.

Förnekarna reser, festar, shoppar runt som vanligt och skiter i sina medmänniskor.

Jag står med några få i mitten.

Det ska dock sägas. Förnekarna har garanterat blod på sina händer, om än så omedvetet.
Citera
2020-07-31, 03:03
  #358169
Medlem
IMBILDENs avatar
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av bartram
Nu har jag inte följt tråden på ett tag. Kan nån kortfattat förklara:

a) HUr kan man som Tegnell/Britton spekulera i att STHLM kan ha nått partiell immunitet m h t de nu redovisade antikroppsstatistiken. Det finns ju områden utan nån smitta alls. Menar man att statistiken är missvisande och att verkligt antal smittade är betydligt högre men att många aldrig utvecklat antikroppar. Men det måste ju i så fall även omfatta rika områden annars blir det ju bara partiell immunitet på vissa geografiska områden. Så vad snackar man om?

b) När och varför har Tegnell bytt fot om att kollektivtrafiken är en smittkälla. I början av epedemin sa han att det inte var några problem med att åka kollektivt

Det är rätt uppenbart att det inte finns någon som helst immunitet i stora delar av Stockholm. Hela innerstan exempelvis. Inte ens 5% har antikroppar.

Ända sedan pandemin startade har det varit uppenbart att Folkhälsomyndigheten sett det som sin uppgift att gjuta olja på vågorna. Funktioner och institutioner i samhället som bedöms som samhällsviktiga bedöms "inte smitta". Skolor och kollektivtrafik exempelvis. Däremot bedöms det som en risk att hålla nöjesparker öppna, så Gröna Lund håller stängt i år. Barn bedöms inte smitta, men de får ändå inte träffa mormor, morfar, farmor och farfar.

https://www.svt.se/nyheter/inrikes/tegnell-om-skolstangingar-stangda-skolor-drabbar-barn

Men i Israel verkar man däremot se ett kraftigt samband mellan öppna skolor och smittspridning i samhället.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/israelis-fear-schools-reopened-too-soon-as-covid-19-cases-climb-11594760001

Det är bland annat det här som gör att i alla fall mitt förtroende för Folkhälsomyndigheten inte ligger direkt på topp. Som jag ser det är det Folkhälsomyndighetens (inkluderande fd Smittskyddsinstitutets)
uppgift att förhindra smitta. De ska föreslå åtgärder för att minska smitta.

Vill så regeringen inte genomföra åtgärder då de gör andra överväganden, såsom exempelvis ekonomi eller värnandet av social stabilitet i förorter m.m. så är det upp till regeringen att göra sådana överväganden. Då får man också motivera hur man tänker. Det skulle uppfattas som betydligt mer ärligt och transparent.
Citera
2020-07-31, 03:04
  #358170
Medlem
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av Kaptenstjärt
a) Antikroppar verkar vara ett tveksamt sätt att bekräfta att man har haft Covid-19
https://www.dn.se/nyheter/sverige/antikroppstesterna-kostar-staten-2-miljarder/

This isn’t true. Everybody makes measurable antibodies. A small percentage (15%~) of asymptomatic cases may lose these antibodies after several months — but he’s right to ask this question. Stockholm hasn’t reached partial immunity yet, otherwise we would see this in the statistics.
Citera
2020-07-31, 03:53
  #358171
Medlem
Merwinnas avatar
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av IMBILDEN

Det är bland annat det här som gör att i alla fall mitt förtroende för Folkhälsomyndigheten inte ligger direkt på topp. Som jag ser det är det Folkhälsomyndighetens (inkluderande fd Smittskyddsinstitutets)
uppgift att förhindra smitta. De ska föreslå åtgärder för att minska smitta.

Vill så regeringen inte genomföra åtgärder då de gör andra överväganden, såsom exempelvis ekonomi eller värnandet av social stabilitet i förorter m.m. så är det upp till regeringen att göra sådana överväganden. Då får man också motivera hur man tänker. Det skulle uppfattas som betydligt mer ärligt och transparent.

Ja, det är detta jag har sagt hela tiden. VAR ÄRLIGA! LJUG inte för oss:

- barn kan inte smittas och smittar inte heller vidare
- reserestriktioner, indragna trafiktillstånd och stängda gränser har aldrig haft något effekt någonsin
- tvångskarantäner och lockdowns gör mer skada än nytta
- screening av flygplans- och fartygspassagerare tar oerhört mycket resurser, och har nästan ingen effekt
o.s.v. o.s.v..

Säg i stället sanningen och redovisa öppet hur ni tänker, kära FHM!

"Vi VET att många tusen människor kommer att dö, och ännu flera gå igenom en svår sjukdom och därefter en lång rehabilitering, och att många av dessa också kommer att få permanenta skador, på grund av att vi inte stänger skolor, inte inför reserestriktioner, inte stänger gränser, inte drar in flygtillstånd, inte inför tvångskarantän, inte tillämpar lockdown, inte screenar flygplanspassagerare, o.s.v.. Men vi menar att de här och de här och de här orsakerna gör, att vi väljer att ta den kostnaden".
Citera
2020-07-31, 03:53
  #358172
Medlem
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av Enelalm
Min läkare på lungmottagningen på ett universitetssjukhus här hemma i Sverige önskar att jag illa kvickt vaccineras. Tills dess bör jag hålla mig hemma. Skulle jag insjukna i covid så är det med stor sannolikhet plingplongbil till IVA.

Vem av dem tycker du jag ska lyssna på?



Din läkare är självklart lika illa insatt i detta som de allra flesta människor på denna planet. Ingen läkare kan säga säkert vad detta handlar om. På förekommen anledning. Men tack vare internet och YouTube så har vi en god chans att sprida den kunskap som många insatta har. Till exempel Dr Carrie Mawdie, i denna video. Om du tar dig tid och lyssnar på henne, så förstår du vad jag menar.
Citera
2020-07-31, 03:55
  #358173
Medlem
Merwinnas avatar
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av burzi
Din läkare är självklart lika illa insatt i detta som de allra flesta människor på denna planet. Ingen läkare kan säga säkert vad detta handlar om. På förekommen anledning. Men tack vare internet och YouTube så har vi en god chans att sprida den kunskap som många insatta har. Till exempel Dr Carrie Mawdie, i denna video. Om du tar dig tid och lyssnar på henne, så förstår du vad jag menar.

Håller med. När det gäller en helt ny sjukdom, så vet naturligtvis inte random läkare mer än random Medelsvensson (som håller sig uppdaterad på nyheter och sociala media). Det finns en övertro på diverse "experter" i Sverige.
Citera
2020-07-31, 04:00
  #358174
Medlem
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av burzi
Din läkare är självklart lika illa insatt i detta som de allra flesta människor på denna planet. Ingen läkare kan säga säkert vad detta handlar om. På förekommen anledning. Men tack vare internet och YouTube så har vi en god chans att sprida den kunskap som många insatta har. Till exempel Dr Carrie Mawdie, i denna video. Om du tar dig tid och lyssnar på henne, så förstår du vad jag menar.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRYsN9IL1As&t=1564s


Här får du läsa i text, de sista 10 minuterna av hennes berättelse:

Dr Carrie Mawdie as she reads from a written document. Transcript from 16.25 to 26.00 in this video. Ordagrann återgivning i text av de sista 10 minuterna av hennes berättelse)

”… so let´s go back to the topic, why the vaccines are being pushed so heavily on us, if the current research and evidence, for using them, is fraud. So, let´s follow the money, and that usually will give you some better ideas. Since 2011 the german company CureVac was given 33 million dollars for the research and development of RNA vaccines. Then in 2013, Moderna Theurapeutics, was given 25 millions for their research and development of RNA vaccines. And then in 2015 Inovio was given 45 millions for their DNA vaccines, which they also mention, admittance to using DNA Nano technology. Nano technology, it´s using microscopic, very tiny little, robotic organisms. Okay. All of these companies are backed by the Gates Foundation, or have been associated with the Gates Foundation in some way. It´s important to know that, so far, these companies have been unable to get these products licensed for human use, due to the fact that these vaccines have failed to provide sufficient immunity in human trials. Sufficient immunity is, again, only stating that you have a certain amount of antibodies. This, again, is not showing that the person is completely immune out in the public. To, whatever virus or bacteria they trying to protect you from. It´s only looking, in vitro, in a testtube, how many antibodies. This is not good science, yet to prove the efficacy of these vaccines. Even if they could get this. In 2010, DARPA, which is the Pentagons´ defence advanced researchprojects agency – military agency – started focusing on DNA- and RNA-vaccines, and they had a synthetic DNA-vaccine that could be delivered via noninvasive electroporation, just using a kind of a sticker, with microneedles in it, on your skin. You can barely feel it go in there. Their words, in quotation, it is: ”To enhance and subvert”, end of quotation, humans at a genetic level. This is around the same year Bill Gates heavily started to fund the DNA- and RNA-vaccines with the companies mentioned before. In 2012 DARPA acknowledges a ”brain machine interface”. That is AI, artificial intelligence, and the human brain will form a ”neural network”, and therefore have the ability to communicate by thought alone, or being influenced, or in control, remotely. Okay. So, this is the idea you go into, maybe, your smart home, thinking abot turning on your air condition, the fan, your favourite program, have the stove start cooking something, who knows what. And it happens, because it´s WiFi. That sounds cool, right? But think about that! If it goes one way, it comes back another way. What if the smart home can give you messages to? This all ties it together so (unhearable).
So, another DARPA program, around that time, is ”NextGenNoneSurgicalNanoTechnologyEntry-program” and it involves noninvasive, or minimally invasive, brain computer interfaces to read and write directly on to your brain! (Carrie´s laughing) Do you understand what this means? I´m laughing because it´s blowing my mind away still, even though I´ve known about this for a while. Read and write directly… They´re rewriting what´s happening in your brain! Your memories, your thoughts! Now! People think this is exciting, it´s the Matrix. It´s literally the Matrix. I wanna learn karate, download it, I know karate – your body would know how to do it. I want to learn how to be a french cuisine chef, download it, instantly I can do that. I can learn a language, probably within days, or one day, I don´t know. So, that part sounds cool. You think you can control this? Something else is controling you, something else is rewriting your emotions, your experiencies, you may have artificial memories of things. You don´t know what is reality. You become a computer program… you become a character in a computer program that you do not control. This is not Sci Fi, this is today! This all (unhearable). So, also to know is that DARPA founded a company that produces soft, flexible hydrogel, as I mentioned hydrogels in the past. Injected beneath the skin to perform ”health monitoring”. Important you hear this! They link to a smartphone app, to give the user immediate health insights. However hydrogel nano technology grows and spread in the body once inplanted. We do not know how this effects our DNA. We know that it can send information directly, and continously, to an Artificial Intelligence. Okay. So all of us, in our smartphones, mine included, we have health apps. One way or the other it´s in your phone. Sometimes you have to look under a Google app, or whatever, it´s there. You can disable it, but you can´t erase it. It´s impossible. This is the COVID 19-apps we´re putting in too, it has to do with this. They´re getting you setup, you have the app, you have the software. Now, all you need is this little hydrogel, that´s put there. And then, forever! Everything in your body is measured! For a woman, your ovulation, when you menstruate, how many times you´ve had sex, for a male how many times you´ve had sex, how many alcohol contents in your body, all the vitamins and minerals, if you´re falling down, how many steps you´re taking, if you´re anxious, your emotions, your sleep, everything and everything about you. Continuesly. It´s going to a AI program. What is that doing?
That´s something they are trying to do very fast. They already getting you set up on your smartphone. This is not fantasy, this is real. So, in conclusion. We are entering into uncharted territory that can change what it means to be human. The vaccins for COVID 19 are not safe. By any scientific methodology. They´re introducing cancerous and mutogenic cell-lines into our bodies, and have that for a long time. They´re introducing toxins into our bodies. This has been going on for a long time. They´re introducing different animal genomes into our bodies. This has been going on for a long time. They do not have proof that what they do, what they say the´re going to do, will happen. There´s absolutely no proof. Yet! Okay. They don´t have to have the proof.
The recombinant RNA, the recombinant DNA technology will cause permanent, and unknown, genetic changes in a persons body. Permanent – once their DNA is changed, he or she will live with that change for the rest of their lives. And also, the ripple effects from that genetic change. Who knows what they could be, for the rest of his or her life. There´s no going back! There´s no ”Oh, I got that vaccine, it didn´t work, you know, I wont do it again!”. No! It´s do or die with this! I don´t know, and I don´t think they, whoever is trying to market this, really knows the ultimate outcome. But it doesn´t sound good.
Essentially, this creepy new species, and perhaps destroys an old one, us! Us, as humans as we know. It´s also introducing nanotechnology and it´s robotic effects into the body. This is also suggesting the ability to use it´s vaccine and it´s ancillary products, the things I´ve mentioned just now, some of the names are like ID 2020, etc., to hook up, to hook us all up to a Artificial Intelligence Interface. This is not a one-way street, it is a two-way street.
So. I know it´s a lot of information to digest. And… it scares me. It has scared me for… years. (Carrie starts weeping). I´ve been to scientific meetings where they talk about this. I´ve been to business meetings where they talk about this. This is real, it´s not fantasy. I´ve studied this since I was in my early twenties. And… (a deep sigh from Carrie… she´s weeping) … It´s real. And… we have to speak up now. For us, for our families, for our future generations. For the human race. It´s no joke, guys. Please, do your own research. As much as you can. And start talking, and talking, and don´t stop the social media, stay on all of it! And you start flooding the social media with this. We have a chance if we start to wake up more people. It´s with greatest love and peace I tell you this (Carrie is now weeping uncontrollably) and I´m happy to talk about other topics and subjects, and I´ll give you the references that I have. And… tell me what you think. And… Please! Speak up! Ok? ”
Citera
2020-07-31, 05:15
  #358175
Medlem
KnackeredVonAnkas avatar
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av Kaptenstjärt
a) Antikroppar verkar vara ett tveksamt sätt att bekräfta att man har haft Covid-19
https://www.dn.se/nyheter/sverige/antikroppstesterna-kostar-staten-2-miljarder/

b) Det har dom nog inte gjort egentligen.
Vad är b för svar?

De har sagt att det inte är någon fara ur smittskyddssynpunkt att åka kollektivtrafik. Tegnell påtalade även tidigt att han minsann själv åkte tåg-tunnelbana-buss och det var lugnt.

Nu har han ju vänt totalt och förespråkar t om att skolorna och stora företag skjuter på sina starttider så att kollektivtrafiken blir mindre riskfylld. Han säger dessutom att kollektivtrafiken är en källa till smittspridning mellan grupper av smittade vilka normalt sett aldrig annars kommer i kontakt med varandra. Alltså klustersmittans ”fördelar/nackdelar” beroende på hur man ser på det.
__________________
Senast redigerad av KnackeredVonAnka 2020-07-31 kl. 05:17.
Citera
2020-07-31, 05:20
  #358176
Medlem
KnackeredVonAnkas avatar
Citat:
Ursprungligen postat av burzi
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRYsN9IL1As&t=1564s


Här får du läsa i text, de sista 10 minuterna av hennes berättelse:

Dr Carrie Mawdie as she reads from a written document. Transcript from 16.25 to 26.00 in this video. Ordagrann återgivning i text av de sista 10 minuterna av hennes berättelse)

”… so let´s go back to the topic, why the vaccines are being pushed so heavily on us, if the current research and evidence, for using them, is fraud. So, let´s follow the money, and that usually will give you some better ideas. Since 2011 the german company CureVac was given 33 million dollars for the research and development of RNA vaccines. Then in 2013, Moderna Theurapeutics, was given 25 millions for their research and development of RNA vaccines. And then in 2015 Inovio was given 45 millions for their DNA vaccines, which they also mention, admittance to using DNA Nano technology. Nano technology, it´s using microscopic, very tiny little, robotic organisms. Okay. All of these companies are backed by the Gates Foundation, or have been associated with the Gates Foundation in some way. It´s important to know that, so far, these companies have been unable to get these products licensed for human use, due to the fact that these vaccines have failed to provide sufficient immunity in human trials. Sufficient immunity is, again, only stating that you have a certain amount of antibodies. This, again, is not showing that the person is completely immune out in the public. To, whatever virus or bacteria they trying to protect you from. It´s only looking, in vitro, in a testtube, how many antibodies. This is not good science, yet to prove the efficacy of these vaccines. Even if they could get this. In 2010, DARPA, which is the Pentagons´ defence advanced researchprojects agency – military agency – started focusing on DNA- and RNA-vaccines, and they had a synthetic DNA-vaccine that could be delivered via noninvasive electroporation, just using a kind of a sticker, with microneedles in it, on your skin. You can barely feel it go in there. Their words, in quotation, it is: ”To enhance and subvert”, end of quotation, humans at a genetic level. This is around the same year Bill Gates heavily started to fund the DNA- and RNA-vaccines with the companies mentioned before. In 2012 DARPA acknowledges a ”brain machine interface”. That is AI, artificial intelligence, and the human brain will form a ”neural network”, and therefore have the ability to communicate by thought alone, or being influenced, or in control, remotely. Okay. So, this is the idea you go into, maybe, your smart home, thinking abot turning on your air condition, the fan, your favourite program, have the stove start cooking something, who knows what. And it happens, because it´s WiFi. That sounds cool, right? But think about that! If it goes one way, it comes back another way. What if the smart home can give you messages to? This all ties it together so (unhearable).
So, another DARPA program, around that time, is ”NextGenNoneSurgicalNanoTechnologyEntry-program” and it involves noninvasive, or minimally invasive, brain computer interfaces to read and write directly on to your brain! (Carrie´s laughing) Do you understand what this means? I´m laughing because it´s blowing my mind away still, even though I´ve known about this for a while. Read and write directly… They´re rewriting what´s happening in your brain! Your memories, your thoughts! Now! People think this is exciting, it´s the Matrix. It´s literally the Matrix. I wanna learn karate, download it, I know karate – your body would know how to do it. I want to learn how to be a french cuisine chef, download it, instantly I can do that. I can learn a language, probably within days, or one day, I don´t know. So, that part sounds cool. You think you can control this? Something else is controling you, something else is rewriting your emotions, your experiencies, you may have artificial memories of things. You don´t know what is reality. You become a computer program… you become a character in a computer program that you do not control. This is not Sci Fi, this is today! This all (unhearable). So, also to know is that DARPA founded a company that produces soft, flexible hydrogel, as I mentioned hydrogels in the past. Injected beneath the skin to perform ”health monitoring”. Important you hear this! They link to a smartphone app, to give the user immediate health insights. However hydrogel nano technology grows and spread in the body once inplanted. We do not know how this effects our DNA. We know that it can send information directly, and continously, to an Artificial Intelligence. Okay. So all of us, in our smartphones, mine included, we have health apps. One way or the other it´s in your phone. Sometimes you have to look under a Google app, or whatever, it´s there. You can disable it, but you can´t erase it. It´s impossible. This is the COVID 19-apps we´re putting in too, it has to do with this. They´re getting you setup, you have the app, you have the software. Now, all you need is this little hydrogel, that´s put there. And then, forever! Everything in your body is measured! For a woman, your ovulation, when you menstruate, how many times you´ve had sex, for a male how many times you´ve had sex, how many alcohol contents in your body, all the vitamins and minerals, if you´re falling down, how many steps you´re taking, if you´re anxious, your emotions, your sleep, everything and everything about you. Continuesly. It´s going to a AI program. What is that doing?
That´s something they are trying to do very fast. They already getting you set up on your smartphone. This is not fantasy, this is real. So, in conclusion. We are entering into uncharted territory that can change what it means to be human. The vaccins for COVID 19 are not safe. By any scientific methodology. They´re introducing cancerous and mutogenic cell-lines into our bodies, and have that for a long time. They´re introducing toxins into our bodies. This has been going on for a long time. They´re introducing different animal genomes into our bodies. This has been going on for a long time. They do not have proof that what they do, what they say the´re going to do, will happen. There´s absolutely no proof. Yet! Okay. They don´t have to have the proof.
The recombinant RNA, the recombinant DNA technology will cause permanent, and unknown, genetic changes in a persons body. Permanent – once their DNA is changed, he or she will live with that change for the rest of their lives. And also, the ripple effects from that genetic change. Who knows what they could be, for the rest of his or her life. There´s no going back! There´s no ”Oh, I got that vaccine, it didn´t work, you know, I wont do it again!”. No! It´s do or die with this! I don´t know, and I don´t think they, whoever is trying to market this, really knows the ultimate outcome. But it doesn´t sound good.
Essentially, this creepy new species, and perhaps destroys an old one, us! Us, as humans as we know. It´s also introducing nanotechnology and it´s robotic effects into the body. This is also suggesting the ability to use it´s vaccine and it´s ancillary products, the things I´ve mentioned just now, some of the names are like ID 2020, etc., to hook up, to hook us all up to a Artificial Intelligence Interface. This is not a one-way street, it is a two-way street.
So. I know it´s a lot of information to digest. And… it scares me. It has scared me for… years. (Carrie starts weeping). I´ve been to scientific meetings where they talk about this. I´ve been to business meetings where they talk about this. This is real, it´s not fantasy. I´ve studied this since I was in my early twenties. And… (a deep sigh from Carrie… she´s weeping) … It´s real. And… we have to speak up now. For us, for our families, for our future generations. For the human race. It´s no joke, guys. Please, do your own research. As much as you can. And start talking, and talking, and don´t stop the social media, stay on all of it! And you start flooding the social media with this. We have a chance if we start to wake up more people. It´s with greatest love and peace I tell you this (Carrie is now weeping uncontrollably) and I´m happy to talk about other topics and subjects, and I´ll give you the references that I have. And… tell me what you think. And… Please! Speak up! Ok? ”

Sluta sprida en massa konspiratorisk skit!
Citera

Skapa ett konto eller logga in för att kommentera

Du måste vara medlem för att kunna kommentera

Skapa ett konto

Det är enkelt att registrera ett nytt konto

Bli medlem

Logga in

Har du redan ett konto? Logga in här

Logga in