Var profeten Muhammed pedofil? (sammanfogad tråd)

Om jag har fattat det riktigt så anser man inom islam att inte bara koranen utan även profetens liv som är normerade för vad som är en sann islam.

En av Muhammeds fruar skall ha varit Aisha och äkteskapet sall ha ingåtts då hon var sex år. Dock skall inte äktenskapet ha fullbordats genom samlag förren hon var nio år.

Jag inser givetvis att det är anakronistiskt att bedömma Muhammed efter vår tids värderingar, men nu hade vi nog kallat det för ett utslag av pedofili.

Efter att ha läst Pluxors inlägg vet jag naturligtvis att det finns de som anser att pedofili kan vara något positivt, men flertalet ser det nog inte så.

Det jag undrar över är om man, som anhängare av islam, skall var förpliktad att se pedofili som något possitivt, med hänvisning till att det utövades av profeten Muhammed.

www.homa.org

Härovan finner du fakta om att inte enbart Muhammed utan även Ayatollah Khomeini, den i modern tid mest inflytelserike muslimen var pedofiler.

Ett fruktansvärt citat ur en av Khomeinis böcker översatt till engelska.
Boken heter "Tahrir-ol-Masael".

A man can marry a girl younger than nine years of age, even if the girl is still a baby being breastfed. A man, however is prohibited from having intercourse with a girl younger than nine, other sexual act such as forplay, rubbing, kissing and sodomy is allowed. A man having intercourse with a girl younger than nine years of age has not comitted a crime, but only an infraction, if the girl is not permanently damaged. If the girl, however, is permanently damaged, the man must provide for her all her life. But this girl will not count as one of the man's four permanent wives. He also is not permitted to marry the girl's sister.

Det är inte för inte som Michael Jackson känner sig lockad av islam.

Lite mer om den "gode" Muhammed:
1. Muhammed felt he was possesed, others who personally knew him felt the same.
A. "Muhammed's foster mother, Halima, stated her conviction that 'in answer to a direct question from his mother I admitted that I thought that he was possesses by a devil'". Islam by Alfred Guillaume, page 25, The Facts on Islam Dr. John Ankerberg, page 10.

B. "Islam was founded by Muhammad, a demon-possessed pedophile who had 12 wives - and his last one was a 9-year-old girl. And I will tell you Allah is not Jehovah either. Jehovah's not going to turn you into a terrorist that'll try to bomb people and take the lives of thousands and thousands of people."
Rev. Dr. Jerry Vines, Pastor of First Baptist Church of Jacksonville, Florida

C. "The people of Mecca spoke openly and tauntingly of it (the koran) as a collection of antiquated or fabulous legends, or as palapable sorcery."The Facts on Islam Dr. John Ankerberg, page 11, Rodwell, Koran, page 8 cf. Sura 36, 25, 17.

D. "It seems, however, that Muhammed himself was at first doughtful of the source of these revelations, fearing that he was possessed by one of the Jinn, or spirits..." Sir Norman Anderson, Religions, page 55. The Facts on Islam Dr. John Ankerberg, page 11

E. "Oxford educated Alfred Guillaume was a professor of Arabic at both Princton and the University of London, where he was head of the Department of the Near and Middle East in the School of Oriental and African Studies. He states 'Men with a mysterious esoteric knowledge which was generally attributed to a familar spirit called a jinn or shaytan.'" Islam by Alfred Guillaume, page 28, The Facts on Islam Dr. John Ankerberg, page 11.

F. Who were Muhammad's first supposed converts? Genies! Yes, Muhammad supposedly preached to and converted genies in Suras 46:29-35; 72:1-28. How convenient that there was no one around to confirm his prophethood.

2. Muhammed decided to make up his own religion and started with a pagan moon god named allah. That is why you see the cresent moon in Islam.

*"But perhaps Muslims have forgotten that it was "Allah" who was originally the pagan god. Scolars agree that before Muhammed, "Allah" was one of the pagan dieties of the pre-Islamic Arabic pantheon of gods-and not even the central diety." The Facts on Islam

* ``The name of Allah, as the Quran itself is witness, was well known in pre-Islamic Arabia. Indeed, both it and its feminine form 'Allat', are found not infrequently among the theophorous names in inscriptions from North Africa.'' (Arthur Jeffery, Islam: Muhammed and his religion, p 85).

* ``'Allah' is a proper name, applicable only to their [Arabs] peculiar god. (Hastings, Encyclopedia of Religion and Ethics, I.326).

* ``'Allah' is a pre-Islamic name...corresponding to the Babylonian Bel.'' (Paul Meagher,Thomas O' Brein, in ERE, I.117).

* ``The Arabs, before the time of Muhammed accepted and worshipped, after a fashion, a supreme god called 'Allah'. (Encyclopaedia of Islam, I.302).

* "The name of 'Allah' is also evident in archeological and literary remains of pre-Islamic Arabia". (Kenneth Cragg, The Call of the Minaret, p. 31).

* 'Allah' was known to the pre-Islamic Arabs and it was one of the Meccan deities. (H. Gibb, Encyclopedia of Islam, I.46).

* "The name of Allah goes back before Muhammed." (Anthony Mercatante, The Facts on Index, Encyclopedia of World Mythology and Legend, I.41)

* "There is no reason, therefore, to accept that Allah passed to the Muslims from the Jews and Christians." (Caesar Farah, Islam : Beliefs and Observations, p. 28).

* According to Middle East scholar E.M. Wherry, in pre-Islamic times, Allah-worship, as well as the worship of Baal, were both astral religions in that they involved the worship of the stars, the sun and the moon. (A Comprehensive Commentary on the Quran, p. 36).

* In Arabia, the sun god was viewed as a female goddess and the moon as the male god. One of the moon god's name was called Allah. (Alfred Guilluame, Islam, p. 7.)

* Allah, the moon god was married to the sun goddess. Together they produce the three goddess (the daughters of Allah), Al-Lat, Al-Uzza and Manat. All of these 'gods' were viewed as being the top of the pantheon of Arab deities. (Encyclopedia of World Mythology and Legend, I.61).

3. Muhammed started to write a book about his supposed visions. However, Muhammed could not read or write. He trusted others to write the material for him.

"The recording of the prophet's words in the beginning were haphazard. Verses were written on palm leaves, stones, the shoulder-blades of animals-in short, on any material that was available".

"Mohammed did not write the Koran or see it completed before his death. Abu Bakr asked people who memorized it to write down their memories about it. There were seven readings of the Koran until the year 30. He collected the other Koran's and burned them, keeping his version."

Source:The Facts on Islam Dr. John Ankerberg

4. *The Quran is a messed up fraud.

While the Bible accurately records actual people, places and events, the Quran is a jumbled up mess. Some comments:

"It is a toilsome reading as I ever undertook, a wearisome, confused jumble, crude, incondite." Thomas Carlyle, Scottish Scholar [2]

"From the literary point of view, the Koran has little merit. Declamation, repetition, puerility, a lack of logic and coherence strike the unprepared reader at every turn. It is humiliating to the human intellect to think that this mediocre literature has been the subject of innumerable commentaries, and that millions of men are still wasting time absorbing it."

Salomon Reinach, German Scholar [3] "an incoherent rhapsody of fable, and precept, and declamation, which sometimes crawls in the dust, and sometimes is lost in the clouds."

Edward Gibbon, Historian [4] "The matter of the Koran is exceedingly incoherent and sententious, the book evidently being without any logical order of thought either as a whole or in its parts. This agrees with the desultory and incidental manner in which it is said to have been delivered."

McClintock and Strong's Encyclopedia [5] "Unfortunately the Qor'an was badly edited and its contents are very obtusely arranged. All students of the Qor'an wonder why the editors did not use the natural and logical method of ordering by date of revelation..."

jag har läst flera gånger att muhammed profeten är pedofil? är det sant? vart har man fått det ifrån? källor?

Det handlar om en hadith där Muhammed, som vid tillfället var medelålders, gifter sig med en 6-åring och "fullbordar" äktenskapet när flickan ifråga var 9. I folkmun kanske detta klassas som pedofili, men vi kan inte utifrån den information vi har kalla Muhammed för pedofil enligt den tekinska definitionen som återfinns i b.la DSM-IV.

Detta är ett av flashbacks favoritämnen, så sök i äldre trådar och du kommer finna en outsinlig guldgruva av disskusioner om ämnet.

Han gifte sig med en sexåring och hade sex med henne när hon kom in i puberteten vid nio års ålder.

Sök i ämet, knappast så att det inte diskuterats förut.. Källor har du i haditherna. Bl.a dessa från sahih muslim:

Book 008, Number 3309:

'A'isha (Allah be pleased with her) reported: Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) married me when I was six years old, and I was admitted to his house at the age of nine. She further said: We went to Medina and I had an attack of fever for a month, and my hair had come down to the earlobes. Umm Ruman (my mother) came to me and I was at that time on a swing along with my playmates. She called me loudly and I went to her and I did not know what she had wanted of me. She took hold of my hand and took me to the door, and I was saying: Ha, ha (as if I was gasping), until the agitation of my heart was over. She took me to a house, where had gathered the women of the Ansar. They all blessed me and wished me good luck and said: May you have share in good. She (my mother) entrusted me to them. They washed my head and embellished me and nothing frightened me. Allah's Messenger (, may peace be upon him) came there in the morning, and I was entrusted to him.


Book 008, Number 3311:

'A'isha (Allah be pleased with her) reported that Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) married her when she was seven years old, and he was taken to his house as a bride when she was nine, and her dolls were with her; and when he (the Holy Prophet) died she was eighteen years old.


Om han verkligen var pedofil eller inte kan dock diskuteras, han hade ju en hel del anda fruar som alla var vuxna.

Om man med sitt rena samvete kan fria någon från pedofilmisstankar, därför att den misstänkte, både tidigare och senare haft förhållanden med äldre kvinnor, och att förövaren "väntat" tills barnet var "könsmoget" (om man nu anser en 9:åring någonsin kunna vara det?) så är/var den personen inte pedofil.

Med andra ord så skulle det knappast existera några pedofiler övht.

Om ditt rena samvete däremot säger att någon är pedofil, om den personen - en fullvuxen äldre man - önskar ingå/ingår äktenskap med ett 6:årigt barn, och som sedan idkar sexuell samvaro med barnet när hon är 9 år. Ja då är han pedofil.
As simple as that.

Ja, med dagens mått räknat var Muhammed pedofil.

Med dåtidens mått räknat var han säkert inte pedofil.

Så dikussionen kan pågå i all oändlighet, det är en definitionsfråga kort sagt.