[WW2] - Auschwitz

Jag har mailat Populär Historia och frågat om de kan tänka sig att publicera en artikel som kan tänkas vara inte fullt lika inställsam som ovanstående - en artikel som torde skapa debatt och som tar upp en annan sida av myntet...
Inte för att jag har någon sådan klar, men det ska bli kul att se hur pass öppna de är inför förslaget.

Ja, deras svar vill vi gärna se i tråden!

Vad tror annars ärade (och mindre ärade ) forummedlemmar om Auschwitz som fenomen, är det inte helt sagolikt vilken mytbildning som skapats kring detta namn, denna plats? Vad ligger de sannolika totala dödssiffrorna på, enligt era förmodanden, och hur ska den ortodoxa historieskrivningen kunna komma till rätta med de enorma överdrifter som tidigare under hot om bannlysning härskade oinskränkt i fallet Auschwitz?

Ett par i tråden nya artiklar som analyserar Pressacs försök att svara revisionisterna, samt Carlo Mattognos granskning av de falska vittnena C.S.Bendel och Ada Bimko:

http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v11/v11p177_Aynat.html

http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v10/v10p461_Mattogno.html

http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v10/v10p-25_Mattogno.html

När jag för någon vecka sedan för första gången började yttra mig offentligt om detta milt sagt brännbara ämne var det enda lilla tvivel jag hade om möjligheten av gasningar vad som kallats Fritjof Meyers tes, att Zyklon B-avrättningar ägt rum i de två "ombyggda bondgårdarna" ("bunkrarna") som påstås ha legat utanför Birkenau. Den outtröttlige och obeveklige Carlo Mattogno har dock skrivit en monografi som tycks utesluta denna möjlighet helt och hållet...så tills de Utrotningstroende, som hatade den vänsterliberale Der Spiegel-redaktören Meyer för att han instämde i revisionisternas åsikter att inga gasningar kan ha ägt rum i de faciliteter som pekats ut i Auschwitz-och Birkenaulägret, utförligt och övertygande vederlagt Mattogno så anser jag att inget talar för att dessa "bunkrar" användes för något massmord heller.
Highway to hell, med andra ord :

http://revforum.yourforum.org/viewtopic.php?t=1541

Och här bra kvalitet på krigstida Auschwitzflygfoton, samt en diskussion om innebörden av vad bilderna visar:

http://revforum.yourforum.org/viewtopic.php?t=1514

Okej, kalla mig grym och hjärtlös, men jag tycker detta är så sanslöst att det är svårt att undertrycka ett skratt:

http://revforum.yourforum.org/viewtopic.php?t=845

"The Seven Dwarfs of Auschwitz
and their amazing story of survival

from Allan Hall
in Berlin
_______________

From the horror of Auschwitz, an astonishing story of survival has
emerged after almost six decades.

It concerns a troupe of Jewish travelling musicians named Ovitz,
comprising seven dwarfs and their two full-sized sisters.

They actually heard the gas chamber door clang shut on them, and
smell the poison gas seeping in.

But their lives were saved by Dr Josef Mengele, the Polish death
camp's evil doctor.

He acted not from compassion, but because he saw in them the chance to
further his research in creating an Aryan master race.

The nine became human guinea pigs for the Nazis, enduring a
succession of agonising and degrading experiments.

In the end, however, they lived - the only family to emerge intact
from the SS killing complex.

And today, 58 years and a day after the liberation of Auschwitz their
incredible history is revealed in a book named 'In Our Hearts We Were
Giants - the survival of a Lilliput family'.---


En tråd för mer teknikorienterade som på ett lugnt sätt, med åtskilliga foton inkluderade, diskuterar de fyra hålen i krematorietaket ("gaskammartaket") som inte tycks ha funnits där de enligt Holocaustprofeterna borde ha existerat:

http://revforum.yourforum.org/viewtopic.php?t=23


Det påstås från "officiella källor" att den man som används för att skrämma barn med, dr Mengele, lämnat efter sig dagböcker i Brasilien, som först i höstas började studeras av forskare. Och jag undrar likt Hannover på revisionistforumet om vi någonsin får ta del av dessa dagböcker, som bör sträcka sig fram till 70-talet (han dog 1979):

http://revforum.yourforum.org/viewtopic.php?t=1506

Det nämndes tidigare nåt om utgrävningar eller andra undersökningar efter gravar eller annat.

Har det gjorts några sådana i Auschwitz? Vad var resultatet? Hittade de nåt?


Dr Tinnitus

Jag känner inte till några större utgrävningar runt Auschwitz. Hade man hittat något så skulle de väl använt det som ett argument vid det här laget. Kanske ryssarna gjorde någon form av undersökning direkt efter övertagandet?

Däremot vet jag inte om man har haft tillåtelse att gräva där, vilket givetvis gör det omöjligt att hitta något alls.

Grabbarna på Revisionistforumet diskuterar tålmodigt Robert Jan van Pelts böcker om Auschwitz:

http://revforum.yourforum.org/viewtopic.php?t=268


Och här dryftas i detalj arkitektritningar på krematorier och bårhus - och de ber uttryckligen om inlägg från någon "true believer", alltså någon Holocaustgasmystiker:

http://revforum.yourforum.org/viewtopic.php?t=985

Intressanta detaljer om Kremer och de olika rättegångarna (inget om gasning nämns ju som sagt i hans krigstida dagbok):

http://www.vho.org/GB/Journals/JHR/6...on133-181.html

"---I said that Professor Kremer, appearing before the tribunal in Münster (Westphalia) in 1960, had confirmed the confession that Communist examining magistrate Jan Sehn (of Jewish origin?) had obtained from him in 1947 and that at the Frankfurt Trial (1963-1965) he had been called as a prosecution witness against his compatriots. What I did not yet know in 1980 and what I learned later is the reason why the poor man, after ten years of prison in Poland (1947-1957) and after returning to his city of Münster, had gone before a German tribunal. I discovered the reason while reading, in its French version, the Anthologie d'Auschwitz (blue), Volume 1, Part 1, Warsaw, 1969, pp.239 to 261.The reason is that after his return to Münster in 1957, Kremer began to protest against the treatment that he had undergone at the hands of the Polish courts and (using here the words used by the Polish Communists themselves in the Anthologie)

[by his protests and by his request to regain his chair as a professor, Kremer attracted the attention] of certain circles and of certain persons who made him appear once more before the Courts (p.239).

Kremer, as a matter of fact, had complained that in Poland "only hatred was entitled to give its opinion" (p.240). Better than that, we learn, thanks to that Communist publication, that after his return to Münster Kremer retracted his confessions. In the pious Communist jargon:

[Kremer] disputed the explanations that he had furnished during the investigation in Cracow and which had been read to him [at the Münster tribunal] (p.242).

The most degrading fact for the judges of the Münster tribunal was the complacency with which they had heard the explanations furnished by Jan Sehn, who had come from Cracow. You must read the Communist account of that session. It ought to be quoted in its entirety. In Cracow in 1947, Kremer had not had any choice. It had been necessary for him to confess. The most astonishing thing is what Jan Sehn himself ended up saying before the German judges. As far as he was concerned, from the start Kremer did not have the right to plead not guilty. Jan Sehn said, with a marvelous lack of awareness of what he was saying:

A declaration of innocence would have been incompatible with what the accused had written [in his private diary] (p.246).---

His Polish and German tormentors profited from him to the very end. Kremer was used like a puppet. He came to the Frankfurt Trial to make a forced appearance there. According to his own words, he had experienced 'a dilemma that is not simple for human understanding." Listen to his final declaration at the Münster trial in 1960 and tell me whether that declaration is that of an abominable criminal who supposedly participated in horrible homicidal gassings or rather that of an unfortunate academic, a sort of inoffensive old fellow who found himself caught - like so many Germans in the past and even today - in a tragic situation where it is necessary to confess (or to make a pretense of confessing) vile crimes which, in reality, were never committed. Listen to Kremer and, through his voice, listen to the voice of so many Germans who have been humiliated, injured and executed:

If according to human criteria I have done something evil, I can only ask you to take into consideration my age and my tragic fate. I have no knowledge of any offense in the juridical and penal sense. I entrust to the Supreme Judge of everyone the task of resolving a dilemma that is not simple for human understanding (p.258).

Professor Kremer, in the final account, was less skillful and prudent than his fellow professor, Wilhelm Pfannenstiel, in the Gerstein case. Pfannenstiel, the father of five children, was able to save a good career for himself thanks to his extremely vague confessions.---"


http://www.ety.com/HRP/booksonline/graf/chap10.htm

"---A very convincing discussion of the Kremer case was provided by Robert Faurisson in his work Memoire en defense (14): The following is his discussion summarized in a few points:

- Auschwitz could easily have been called the "camp of annihilation" in late summer of 1942 even without gas chambers and mass murders, since typhus was claiming 300 victims a day at that time;

- no gassing can have been meant by "special action", since Kremer writes that it took place "outside". (Several Holocaust scribblers, for examples, Wellers, Klarsfeld and Poliakov, have revealingly deleted this word in their reproduction of the dairy entries.) The words "last bunker" cannot possibly have meant one of the two Birkenau farmhouses, otherwise Kremer woud have spoken of the "second" bunker, and not the "last" one;

- in reality, the special action could have consisted of cleaning dirty train carriages after the arrival of new inmates. Special rations were distributed for such unpleasant work;

- Kremer must have attended about 30 executions during his time at Auschwitz. The horrid scenes could have involved something of this nature.

- that Kremer confirmed the reported gassings before his Polish judges is easily explained: he wanted to save his life, and finally succeeded. If he had disputed the official version, he would inevitably have been hanged;

- even his testimony at the Auschwitz Trial was given on understandably opportunist grounds: at the age of eighty, he simply had no desire to spend the last years of his life behind bars, which is what would presumably have happened to him if he had disputed the gassings.

This is how the confessions came to be given. In any case, Kremer mentions gassings expressly in his diary at one point (entry of 1 September): "afternoon at the gassing of a block with Zkylon B against lice."---"

"Varför dödade inte tyskarna varenda jude i Auschwitz-Birkenau?" lyder den högst relevanta men för många kanske något, ähum, plumpa, frågan som behandlas i denna diskussionstråd. 67.000 överlevde där, 60.000 valde att följa med tyskarna västerut hellre än att vänta på bolsjevikerna, de 7000 fångar som stannade var mestadels sjuka och skröpliga:

http://revforum.yourforum.org/viewtopic.php?t=1326

Germar Rudolfs kritik av Robert Jan Van Pelts Auschwitzundersökningar och teorier: så ska forskning bedrivas, fritt och tillgängligt för alla! men tyvärr kan man väl knappast räkna med ett svar från Van Pelt?

http://www.vho.org/GB/c/GR/RudolfOnVanPelt.html#

De dödsfallsregister från Auschwitz som upptäcktes efter Sovjetväldets fall, när antalet officiellt proklamerade dödsoffer i lägret över en natt sjönk med 2,5 miljoner , innebär ett svårt hot för utrotningsförkunnarna, eftersom de tydligt dokumenterar att lägret hyste åtskilliga icke arbetsföra judar. Dödsfallsregistren ingår dock i det väldiga arkivet i Arolsen, som är förbjuden mark för kritiska forskare, så det är att betrakta som ett olycksfall i arbetet att kännedom om delar av dödsfallsregistren överhuvud givits världens skeptiska och fria andar:

http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v12/v12p265_Weber.html

"---Along with the two documents above, the long-hidden certificates reproduced on the following pages discredit a central pillar of the Holocaust extermination story. As revealing as these documents are, though, there is little doubt that a careful examination of all of the many thousands of documents in the Auschwitz death books — as well as other, still-inaccessible wartime records — would bring us much closer to finding definitive answers to the central questions of Germany's wartime Jewish policy. It is high time for archival officials in Poland, Germany, Russia and Israel to open all their records to independent scholars."

http://zgrams.zundelsite.org/piperma...ly/000913.html

"---The ITS archives and files (40 kilometers, I guess) are a fantastic
treasure for the historians. I have been in touch, directly or
indirectly, with the ITS from January 1975 to April 1988 and I can
guarantee you that as a revisionist I would enjoy going freely
through their files to discover the real fate of people who were
supposedly gassed. Remember how I discovered that a certain Simone
Jacob, born on July 13, 1927 in Nice (France) and supposed to have
been gassed in Auschwitz on April 16, 1944, had in fact survived,
married a Mr Veil and became the famous Simone Veil who was at a time
President of the European Parliament. I wrote somewhere that she
could be named President of the falsely gassed.

When the ITS will stop its activities in favour of the survivors or
of their legal successors, we'll have to wait fifty years to get into
their archives and files.

"Fifty years after the Service is closed, the material that has been
so industriously collected can be made available to research"
(Carlheinz Tüllmann, Rheinische Post, Düsseldorf, 14. Dezember 1985;
article reproduced in English in The German Tribune, Hamburg, January
12, 1986, p. 14).

So I am afraid we'll have to wait 2070 or 2080.

Ernst Zündel understood more than anyone how attached I was to the
Arolsen matter. In a fax I sent him on May 1, 1990, I congratulated
him for an initiative he had re the ICRC and the ITS and I added:

"The only thing that everyone, and especially every German taxpayer,
should simply ask is: REOPEN THE HISTORISCHE ABTEILUNG OF THE
INTERNATIONAL TRACING SERVICE IN AROLSEN". And I added : "Remember
that in my life of searcher I had at least two 'idées fixes' : 1) An
expertise of the weapon of the crime in Auschwitz, 2) A free
examination of the Arolsen files.

A triple "A": "Auschwitz And Arolsen". We got Auschwitz - we still
need Arolsen.---"

Denna studie av Samuel Crowell, The Gas Chamber of Sherlock Holmes, rekommenderas starkt för den som är intresserad av "den successiva litterära konstruktionen" av massgasningshistorierna:

http://vho.org/aaargh/fran/techniques/Holmes1.html